Ordering dishes in a restaurant

Question

Hi there,I have a question about the use of articles when ordering dishes from a restaurant menu. In my dealings with English speakers, I've noticed a lot of variability with the use of articles. Some people use the definite article before the dishes and some don't.E.g. I would like French onion soup, please. I would like the French onion soup, please.I have reached some conclusions of my own about this. Please tell me if these conclusions are correct.  (To the waiter:)I will have lobster, please.Meaning the customer wants some lobster. Very generic.I will have a lobster, please.Meaning the customer wants a whole lobster. Any lobster will do.I will have the lobster, please.Meaning the customer wants the lobster dish on the menu. It may be that this is the only lobster dish on the menu, or it's the lobster he wants and not any other seafood dish on the menu, or perhaps it is a special dish that the restaurant is famous for. Lots of emphasis.Same for our French onion soup example:I will have French onion soup, please.Meaning some French onion soup, period.I will have the French onion soup, please.Meaning the French onion soup dish on the menu. Perhaps it's the only one, or it's the French onion soup the customer wants and not any other soup on the menu, or perhaps it's a dish they are famous for. (I realize "a French onion soup" doesn't sound very nice).Did I get it?Thanks!!Victor

Wilpeter · Accepted Answer

Yes.

Victork · Answer

Thank you!

Mister Micawber · Answer

victorkI will have lobster, please.Meaning the customer wants some lobster. Very generic.

It cannot be generic: the customer is reading the menu. He refers to one or more lobster dishes on the menu.

victorkI will have a lobster, please.Meaning the customer wants a whole lobster. Any lobster will do.

Very odd, even though whole lobsters are on the menu; I doubt a native speaker would say this in a restaurant, though it would be common in a fish market.

victorkI will have the lobster, please.Meaning the customer wants the lobster dish on the menu.

That's right. And it is the only lobster dish on the menu.

However, there are not the discrete differences in meaning that you suggest and that wilpeter's terse answer seems to confirm. The use of the article is for all practical purposes idiolectic.

Xerxes · Answer

I will have to disagree with Mister Micawber's response, at least partially, though no less respectfully for it. While I do agree with his assertion that the use of idioms is for all practical idiolectic and that, in the examples given, I'd personally be inclined to say "the lobster, please" as well, which is the most common way of saying it, I don't think that it is very odd to say, "I will have a lobster, please".

In fact, I am reading a book right now, a gift of my daughter's, and in one of the dialogues a woman at a restaurant says something similar to a waiter: I would like a steak, please. The author of the book is an American.

I do agree that to say "I would like lobster" when you are reading a menu is heavily on the idiosyncratic side of things.

Victork · Answer

You guys are confusing me! <img class='emoticon' style='Width:19px;Height:19px;' data-delaysrc='https://uat-englishforward-forums-backend.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/Emoticons/6.gif' src='https://uat-englishforward-forums-backend.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/Emoticons/6.gif' alt='Emotion: sad'/>

Xerxes · Answer

victorkYou guys are confusing me!

Just use the definite article - it's the easiest thing to do. Nine times out of ten, you won't go wrong. Maybe even ten times out of ten.

Wilpeter · Answer

I feel a little embarrassed that my earlier response was terse. I was more interested in the English Forums language concerns than whether or not one would be happy with the outcome.

A. I will have lobster, please. (One of the lobster dishes, since I've never tried it.)
The waiter then enters into his memorized dialog to narrow it down.

B. I will have a lobster, please. (That establishes this is a seafood establishment.)
The waiter will likely ask you to pick your victim. The intention may be to share the experience with others at the table. This may be a couple’s third date, and impressing the date might be vital. It may be dinner with the boss, with its own complications.

C. I will have the lobster, please. (It may very well be the only dish with that content.)

Note: We haven’t established the size or type of restaurant. “The lobster” may very well be a lobster burger or even an appetizer. If it’s the Red Lobster (chain restaurant), half the customers may be visiting for the first time. Waiters in such restaurants are not vending machines (although some are in training), so one’s initial request is more of an opening gambit.
While all these things went through my mind, I felt we would end up where we actually did.

Victork · Answer

Thanks, guys. Wilpeter, I like your humorous reply! <img class='emoticon' style='Width:19px;Height:19px;' data-delaysrc='https://uat-englishforward-forums-backend.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/Emoticons/1.gif' src='https://uat-englishforward-forums-backend.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/Emoticons/1.gif' alt='Emotion: smile'/>

Xerxes · Answer

I am with Wilpeter. It doesn't really matter, actually, which article you use when you order from a menu, or whether you use an article at all. Really.

CalifJim · Answer

Well, I don't care what you guys are having. I'm having lobster!

CJ

Ordering dishes in a restaurant

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